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| Name: |
Webmaster
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| Subject: |
Alabama DCNR Press Release
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Date:
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8/28/2008 12:27:49 AM
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FYI... News as of today.
URL: Marine Police to increase "3 Lakes" enforcement
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| Name: |
4thelake
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| Subject: |
Alabama DCNR Press Release
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Date:
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8/28/2008 12:23:49 PM
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It would be nice if the Marine Police can chime in and let us know how they will be guided in this area. How will the measurements be taken? How will speed be determined? There are a lot of 30' boats on the lake that run 50 to 55 mph and look like they run a whole lot faster. I also thought the law is still under litigation. So if you have one of these boats and you get a warning, and then a ticket, and then the law is repealed, will you get a refund? I would really rather have the MP at points on the lake keeping it safe for all boaters. I think we would all agree there is a ticket a minuet in the main channel at the rock on any given weekend. Seems like tying them up with this type of enforcement takes away from their safety related duties.
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| Name: |
Webmaster
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| Subject: |
Alabama DCNR Press Release
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Date:
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8/28/2008 1:04:10 PM
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I have an email into Capt. Brooks about determination of the grandfathering. I got to wondering how you prove your boat has a right to exist if you get stopped. All I can think of is 2006 receipts for a marina wet slip. But what if you keep your boat moored at your house? Are you going to need an affidavit from your neighbor stating they saw the boat moored in 2006?
All I can say is list your questions here and maybe we can get answers. The press release did not go into details and the law seems to be written with many details of enforcement to be worked out after the fact (now).
Just sitting here, I've thought of more questions:
The definition of "House Boat" seems to also include vessels like a SeaRay 240 Sundancer. Is this kind of boat prohibited if not grandfathered?
What is the definition of a "fully equipped galley"?
I can certainly see where the Marine Police will be extremely busy enforcing this law.
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| Name: |
head
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| Subject: |
Alabama DCNR Press Release
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Date:
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8/28/2008 4:47:47 PM
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If or when they stop me. I will ask the MP to go ahead and give me a ticket not a warning so we can start to fight this.
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| Name: |
4thelake
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| Subject: |
Alabama DCNR Press Release
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Date:
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8/28/2008 5:11:12 PM
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Just spoke to the Marine Police. They still have the same problems with enforcement. Registration, on most boats, states the size in the vin number. May not be to the inch, so there is a problem. Speed is a big problem for them. I quote " we cannot determine the top speed of any specific boat." "We can't get on a boat and ask the owner to hammer the throttle due to liability." "If an engine blows up, or something goes wrong as a result of a top speed run, then or in the future and we are driving or instructing the owner to do this, guess whose going to be at fault." So he said you may have to sign a statement as to the top speed of your boat and that is all they can do at this point. He basically stated that they still have no real great methods or guidance from anyone in this matter. He did say they have radar guns out this weekend, and if you are going over 60mph on a boat in question, that would say a lot. I did find a term he used to be interesting....UNFUNDED MANDATE... basically says, you spend your budget money and time on this extremely difficult hunt for a small number of offenders. The MP will have to do all the hunting for registrations and other necessary things to enforce a law that their superiors can give them no guidance on. I called all the way up to the DCNR and was referred all the way down to the local division. DCNR had no idea how they would enforce the law, couldn't answer any questions as to guidelines and had no answers to my questions. I sure can think of better things for our MP to do than to chase down these specific boats on a busy holiday weekend. A weekend when the idiots come out in droves. Makes you wonder what individual or individuals are driving this, what seems to me, a still unenforceable law based on upper level administration. I can see it now in court. So tell me sir, under what guideline was Mr. offender given a ticket? You mean you just decided yourself that this specific boat was illegal? There is no written description you are going by for the ticket? Your superiors did not give you specific instructions to determine the size or the speed or the registration date or the residence of the marina or the state of ownership.......If I were employed by the MP, I would want to know how, with no information, I was supposed to conduct myself in front of the judge when someone takes the written ticket to court.
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| Name: |
Webmaster
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| Subject: |
Alabama DCNR Press Release
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Date:
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8/28/2008 5:46:31 PM
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I want to thank Capt. Brooks for responding and allowing this to be posted.
Webmaster
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The permitting process has not begun yet and no one has been issued a permit. That is something our legal section is working on and we hope to have in place very soon. The purpose of this weekend's efforts is to make people aware that we are enforcing the law. We have received complaints that nothing is being done about enforcement and no matter the legal challenges, support or lack of support the law has...it is still the law.
As to the grandfathered boats, this weekend we intend to err on the side of caution. If a boat appears to meet any of the conditions on the surface for grandfathering, we will take the owner's name and contact information down. Once the permitting process is in place, we will notify them of the steps necessary in order to obtain the permit. Among the things we will look at that will prove to us a boat is grandfathered will be: date of manufacturer of the boat, date of sale, marina rental agreements, MSD records, registration records and things of that nature. The permit will require annual renewal. There will be the obvious examples (all boats exceeding the length requirement manufactured after July 1, 2006 for example, would be prohibited) that we will identify and those individuals will be required to remove their boat from the lake or risk a citation.
Our officers will not have the time or the ability on patrol to measure a boat's length and we do not intend to. We will base our initial decision on what is listed on the registration certificate to determine a boat's length. Obviously, this might mislead people into attempting to re-register their boat with a shorter length. By doing so the individual would then be committing a second offense under Title 13A of the State of Alabama criminal code.
As for speed. Most every boat on the lake is "capable" of 60 miles per hour or better if the power supply is big enough. We are going to rely on selective radar enforcement and written manufacturer's ratings to enforce that segment of the law. Obviously if we clock a 28-foot vessel at 65 m.p.h. then we have proven that it is capable of exceeding the maximum speed. Likewise, if the manufacturer rates a certain model for anything over the maximum speed then it would be in violation. We do intend to use unmarked boats during radar enforcement, so it won't be as simple as just avoiding our marked units.
We realize that there are complications in enforcing this law and we do plan to use a heavy dose of commons sense in doing so. However, our job is to enforce the laws enacted by the state legislature and we intend to do that to the best of our ability. I would ask that people continue to be patient with our officers and avoid taking their frustrations out on us as we go through this process. The best place to disagree with or argue against a citation for a violation of this or any law will be in the district court.
Captain Matt Brooks
Alabama Marine Police
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| Name: |
4thelake
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| Subject: |
Alabama DCNR Press Release
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Date:
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8/29/2008 10:04:38 AM
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Ditto..Cpt Brooks.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Alabama DCNR Press Release
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Date:
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8/29/2008 3:48:33 PM
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I understand better the MP's position on the boat ban and sympathize with their dilemma. The fact is this law is going to be terribly difficult to enforce and in the greater scheme of things in my opinion is a terrible waste of their time and resources. I just hope and pray that other more important needs will not go unfulfilled while the MP's are running around the lake in unmarked boats trying to enforce the ban.
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